Canine Distemper

[Explore801]

I purchased a maltipoo from a breeder in San Antonio Texas. A total of 13 puppies have died, 3 confirmed cases of distemper. All other deaths suggestive of distemper My puppy survived. She started with the diarrhea, temp, cough. Was treated for coccidia, c-diff and upper respiratory infection. But, she survived and appears well today. She was born (I am told) on 10/27/08, however, I believe mid November to be more accurate. I received her in December. She was treated with different meds until January 2009. Never showed any neurological problems and appears just fine. However, my vet and I are scared to death to vaccinate her for distemper She is the only living puppy and I can't help to feel that it will be a death sentence to give distemper Am I on the right thinking track? Or should I have her vaccinated. I live in a remote area, where there is some small wild life, , , , I am not sure which way to go with this. Any opinions would be sincerely appreciated! Thank you. Robin Bennett

[Giftbearer]

Hi Robin,

There are some wierd strains in Texas that are harder to detect and are not as predictable as others. Distemper can manifest itself in a number of different ways depending on the strain and the dog's genetics.

I would be reluctant to have her vaccinated too because with her having been exposed to the virus and never sure where it is and whether more symptoms will happen later it could be catastrophic.

Distemper can often lie dormant and then reappear in the central nervous system later, even as much later as 8-10 years!

Please contact me privately for more information on testing and treatment. contact me on facebook here and use the e-mail at the top left of the page and write me where it says “inbox”; [moderator note: website address has been removed]

or in the Save Dogs from Canine Distemper group, here; [moderator note: website address has been removed] and they can also write me on my blog; [moderator note: website address has been removed]

I can put you in touch with Dr. Sears and one of my vets who can speak with your vet if needed.

Sincerely,

Pippit

[Daveyo]

Hi Robin

Seems the moderator keeps sabataging the criticial links of which people need to save their animals. Also I think the moderators are trying their very best to kill these animals, by killing off the vital necessary links to help you save your dog.

Therefore, right now I am doing some legal research, since there are more laws now making it a criminal offense, coming out as of recent in USA, which point to animal rights and of the owners who seek treatment but are being denied the access to obtain help, and we can seek legal redress officially. If I find that there are some FEDERAL laws which can be used to pursue this issue besides also in the state where the official site is located, then I will submit such to the site and have them answer to the court why they keep denying animal owners the right to choose their VET and the right to save their beloved pet and to be provided all the necessary medical help and links so that they can make a reasonable sound decision for themselves.

I make this posting officially because I know the moderators will look at this post and I am serving the notice to them here and I will pursue this legally. I am very angry at them for killing dogs and not cooperating to allow other experts to post links and to provide the assistance needed.

If this animal forum does not want to assist others and does not want others to post links that help others, not want others to post names of VETS who can assist these owners, then SHUT DOWN YOUR SITE OFFICIALLY. Get out of the website, because otherwise it serves no purpose except to blab blab and blab.

If you think your in the legal right to refuse and to remove such information, think again, because I have been checking lately. The laws are slowly going against you and are now favoring dog owners and the medical profession as well. Lawsuits, if your worried about, yes, the lawsuits can be directed against you for denying owners the right and the means to have and to receive medical advice and assistance and links to help them decide otherwise. If you don't believe me then watch it happen.

Now to you Robin,

Hmm, in regards to your pet, it would now be much older than your guess. The pup needs its mother for minimum of 8 weeks to grow and to develop. So I would think if you got your pet in December the October date is more accurate.

So lets have this date as the official birth OK. Sound reasonable. So now your pup will be 4 months going on 5 months of age. Hmmm,

Let me ask you a few questions:

Does your pet show any physical signs of the disease, like brownish teeth where the normal white enamel is gone???

Does your pet show any hardening of the pads?????

Since your dog was in the environment that maybe had Distemper, I would think the mothers antibodies did protect the animal, and what you had was Kennel Cough with a bout of respiratory infection of which is treatable with antibiotics. No problem

Based on your description, here, I strongly do suggest you get this vaccination underway.

Here is what you need to do and please follow the suggested steps to ensure your animal gets protected. It is now absolutely essential and very important.

First of all, it is highly recommended keep apart the Distemper Vaccine and the Parvo Vaccine. In most cases dogs can handle this combo together without any major side effects. DO NOT Give it as a combo type vaccine if this dog was treated for Distemper. You can obtain separate vaccines from from the website named Jeffers here which can be found if you know how to start looking for it. They will send it to you direct.

Secondly, when giving the Vaccine, give only a half dose shot!!!!! A full dose shot is meant for a 60 pound dog. So if you have a small dog this full shot is a lot, and it insults the immune system.

Now you must make sure your dog is healthy and has no ongoing sickness or infections before giving the vaccine shots. Ok

When you give the half dose shot wait minimum of 14 days and then give the other half dose shot. This makes one round under the dogs belt.

Your next target is to give the RABIES shot because your dog is reaching 5 months old and it is imperative to get that Rabies protection. You can give the Rabies shot 5 days after you give the second half dose shot of the first round.

This is how it is

First shot - Half dose combo then wait 14 days
Second shot - Half dose combo, then wait 5 days then give the Rabies, and then continue the Vac
Third shot - Full dose Rabies shot
Fourth shot - Give half dose combo approximately 12 days after the Rabies shot.
Fifth shot - Give half dose combo then wait 14 days This shot makes it 2 full doses under its belt.

After the full second dose is registered to your animal, this at least keeps you out of the real danger.

Also you will not need the third full dose since you have not vaccinated the dog, and it does not have the maternal antibodies anymore. Because of the maternal antibodies present only in young pups that are like 10 weeks or younger, that is why they recommend the third shot. Understand.

The next vaccination is to be given one year later after the final second dose shot. At this time give only half shot and then wait and then give the final half shot. Do the Rabies the same time.

After this you can then give the next booster 3 years later.


What Pippit was saying to you is if the dog did in fact had Distemper and has all the clinical signs pointing to this disease, yes it needs to be treated and taken care of.

In your case you have not described any of its symptoms.

If your dog did have Distemper, it would have experienced full chewing gum act, and already showed the full clinical signs of the disease, and would be experiencing neurological damage effects as well, by this time due to the way you have described your story.

So I am ruling out Distemper based on your story.

No need to be scared as all of us are exposed to various diseases and bacterial agents which would have wiped out humanity if we did not have a good immune system.

That is why I tell you to give only half dose shots. This is much better and it does not insult the immune system. A half dose will be meant for a 30 pound dog. A quarter dose shot is meant for a 15 pound dog. That is the official formula regarding vaccines. Keep in mind vaccine is powerful itself.

Like our cure for Distemper. The cure is a vaccine called Newcastles Disease Virus Vaccine!!!!! This works both for the body and in the CNS. However this is only a one way ticket deal as the dog cannot get a second round of the NDV or it will have a immune cascade problem. Cure is 24 hours.

The other is the Serum which is made by the VET using a donor dog, and it contains the antibodies made from the donor dog and is by far the most recommended, and can be used more than once on most diseases on the animal with absolutely no side effects, and the cure is also 24 hours, so in the meantime most VETS do not have this around, so the NDV vaccine is the next saviour if you wish to call it.

Please follow up on the Vaccination program I have provided to you, and pardon me for also complaining to the forum moderator and warning them at the same time and I will pursue the issue for denying you your access to obtain help.

You are not the only person whom they have denied over the course of time as many others here have also been denied not only in the Distemper forum, but the other forum topics on this site as well, and I have compiled up all their names and made copies of it showing how the moderators have removed the links etc. I will use this in court to prove my point and get a ruling that I know I will WIN!!!!! once such is filed officially and the notice is served officially.

Daveyo

[Explore801]

Hi Daveyo,

Thank you for responding to my post, very helpful. A couple of questions before I pursue. I purchased my puppy from a TERRIBLE breeder. She in fact has been shut down. She took these pups from their moms much earlier than 8 weeks. I and my vet suspect my puppy was 5 weeks old when I recieved her. So, I believe she is going on four months of age. I believe her birthdate to be around the 15th-29th of November 2008. So, therefore, she would not have been supported by her mom's antibodies.

Now, her teeth are nice and white. Pads, although I have never seen distemper "padding", I am confused by my puppy's pads. Because of her breed, her feet are pink with black mixed in, so it is difficult to tell. I look at them all the time as I know this to be a symptom of distemper. They have some callous, but nothing I would find concerning, although I am unsure of this, , , ,thus leading to my further anxiety level. As I said, I have nothing to compare her padding to.

Now, say this puppy was taken away from mom at five weeks of age and exposed to distemper, which I have strong evidence to suppport, , , ,(long, long story), could this disease lie dormant in my puppy. Could giving the vaccine bring this disease out in full force.

Then once we feel it is safe and distemper can be ruled out, I have a question on your advice how to go about this. When you say keep parvo and distemper seperate, , , should she receive the parvo at all?

A vet once told me that given 1/2 doses of the vaccine is ineffective? Is this true? Sometimes, it is difficult to know what the best route is, , , ,I don't trust a lot of the vets around here as they just don't seem to have a lot of knowledge on certain disease processes. . . .this one for sure, , ,I can't get answers anywhere. . .No one knows what to do. I was told that giving half doses does nothing.

No, my puppy does not show any signs or symptoms of the disease. My concern is that I was recently told she could harbour the disease for years even, , , , Again, I didn't want to give the vaccine and have the disease come out in full force. So again, any help would be appreciated!!!!

Yes, shutting down helpful sites should not be allowed, I am not understanding why this is happening, but your help in this matter is greatly appreciated. Thank you. Robin

[Daveyo]

Hi Explorer

Ok as of the birth date of the pup lets say it was about 5-6 weeks old. So between you and your vet on the suspicions I am sure you can decide and make a official birth date and stick with if for the life of the animal. Sound good.

Now I will try to clarify everything for you in concern to all your other matters and put hopefully your anxiety in a peaceful mode.

First of all please get the MRI done on the brain and the spinal cord. If this MRI shows lesions or any demyelination either in the brain or spinal cord this is a conclusive clinical diagnosis of ongoing Distemper disease. This means your animal is infected in the CNS. If so then a NDV-CSF tap is the only way to cure your dog and get rid of it permanently. Prior to doing this tap, you will also have to do the body injection as well because distemper would be harvesting itself in that region. I will help you further if the MRI comes back positive. If the MRI shows no damage or demyelination in either area, then your out of the woods and your dog escaped the disease by pure luck perhaps by having just enough antibodies maternally to protect itself at the time of its occurence.

As of the teeth showing white enamel, that is good news. Dogs infected with Distemper will show teeth damage because the enamel will be of brown color and even have gaps on the enamel requiring enamel rebuilding by a dentist. So this somewhat rules out distemper but that MRI will be the one to tell you completely if it rules it out for certain.

As of the pads, Dogs infected with distemper the pads will become very hard to the touch and it will not be supple and not bend or move when squeezed etc. If the pads do bend and feel supple and move easily then this also can rule out distemper as hardening of the pads is a positive clinical sign of the disease.

As of the color of the pads this is normal and eventually the pads will turn to a dark black color and it may feel a bit abrasive to your touch. Again this is normal to give the dog some firm footing when it walks or runs around.

In keeping the parvo separated from the distemper concerning vaccination this prevents any backlash that can be caused by the distemper vaccine since the parvo opens up the blood brain barrier for a total of approximately 10 days. In keeping it apart and doing the injections separately you are ensuring no side effects happening to your dog - OK.

As of the half dose - your VET does not seem to understand vaccinations very well.

First a full shot dose is meant for a 60 pound dog. If your dog weighs 20 pounds that is a very hard hit to the dogs immune system. Many dogs have some side reactive effects to this shot like feeling lousey, and sick like feeling, not wanting to do much of anything, and having the blahs for a few days. That ois because the immune system got hit with a baseball bat!!!!!!!

Giving a half shot this will not hit them so hard and they can tolerate the little extra without a problem, and it also gives the immune system an easier means to really build up its defense system as well much better.

The main purpose of vaccination shots is to give the memory cells and the auto immune system a snapshot of the virus and once it gets that data it is there for the life of the dog. Like a permanent file kept forever. If the dog does not have the vaccination shot, the memory cells will not know about this virus if it enters the system and it will leave it alone hence for example this virus like Distemper will incubate and build itself up and then attack and go to its intended target.

Once the memory cells get the snapshot and the auto immune system gets the snapshot, then it builds up the defense system and also the antibodies to defend itself. OK

The purpose for the booster shot one year later is to ensure that the memory cells are up to date with the latest vaccine properties and information pertaining to the snapshot, and it also ensures the antibodies defense system is established. From this point on then you can vaccinate your dog once every 3 years to keep the defense system on par for a quick response if ever the virus of any kind for any reason decides to try to attack your animal. Young puppies and young animals up to 1 year and old senior dogs that are like 12 years on up are vulnerable to the attacks because in the young animal it's defense system is not fully established, and the older senior dogs the immune system gets weaker as it ages and also because of getting too many vaccination shots during the middle years. OK. The same concept for humans as well.

That is why I recommend vaccination shots every 3 years which does not hit the immune system so hard and as the dog ages and becomes a senior its immune system will be strong and not break down and be kept up to par.

Here now you know more than some of these VETS and you will be on safe ground. This protocol is the official protocol approved by the VET boards thruout the world.

Now in concern if it can harbor this disease for years, the answer is yes if it survived the initial primary attack of Distemper. Only 1% of the dogs worldwide will survive this disease unscathed, and the other 2% have severe neuro problems which are many. Most dogs who do survive this disease without any treatment will die between 2 weeks to 10 years and it is a very horrible way to die indeed. So over 97% in the entire world, dogs who get Distemper and it is not treated will be dead by the 6th to 7th week of the initial primary attack of Distemper. Today with Dr. Sears and my treatment, all the dogs are surviving with incredible results and are lasting a long time to their full life spans.

So once you get the MRI then let me know ASAP. You need to know also to put your mind in peace. If the MRI comes clean then start the vaccination protocol I gave you and follow it precisely OK. After that your home free. Between now and then protect your dog and keep it inside and make sure the area is clean and has good air circulation etc until you get all the primary initial vaccinations done on the dog.

So from what you have been saying to me here, I too pretty much rule out Distemper but will say it best to get the MRI to confirm it officially since your dog was exposed to the area of the outbreak. I too would wonder just like you>>> did it get my dog or not. Doing that MRI should clear the air once and for all.

The sites I am talking about are the sites not being helpful to dog owners and are killing the links to help other dog owners to make a reasonable sound decision pertaining to their pet. This site has been killing off the links with a great effort and I know these people/owner and certain personnel quite well if I may say so. I am well aware of them trying to corner the medical internet market. Just clarifying my previous statements to you so you can understand it clearly. It is interesting to note that they have been branching out from cornering the Urology market to now pulmonary regions. On the other hand since it is on the human side which is their main objectives I see that they have here touched the VET market as well which by the way human doctors frown upon it in the first place.

I welcome Health communities to also make comments on my site at [moderator note: website address has been removed] and to post links on your topics and believe me I keep my word. Give it a shot Ron or Tom.

Hmmmmmmmmmm ditto ditto indeed.

Hope I have answered all your questions so feel free to write if you want more information at any time.

Daveyo